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Jun. 8th, 2002 | 08:49 am

question for all you soccer fans. how can you get so excited when your "national" team wins if many or most of the players aren't even citizens? or is soccer different from other sports, and players actually come from the country they play for?

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Comments {25}

Sunshine

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from: sunshine_two
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 08:55 am (UTC)
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It's like cheering for the hometown team. Who cares what country they're from? At one time, most of the NHL was made up of Canadians and Europeans, and Americans still cheered for their teams. It's competitive, and to some... fun.

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i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 09:03 am (UTC)
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but it's not a hometown team. maybe this is why i don't like sports much. it's like cheering for the billionaire owner and whatever toys he has purchased this year. now watching the competition can be fun, i agree, but sentimentality about a team just because they use your country/city as part of their name seems silly. the same guy you were booing last year could be your star center next year. and he comes from Chile.

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(Deleted comment)

i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 09:40 am (UTC)
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yes, and the trading and selling of players has accellerated recently, it seems. it used to be you could at least root for the same group of players for a few years. now teams seem to be new every season. jason kidd should be on the suns, dammit!

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James

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from: flashfire
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 09:48 am (UTC)
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But he was originally a Dallas Maverick, so shouldn't Kidd still be there? ;-)

I'm sure he'd still be in Phoenix if it wasn't for that incident with his wife, but even though they've moved on from it the Suns owner didn't want that sort of thing hanging over his team, so he dumped him to NJ.

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i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 09:57 am (UTC)
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see how much i pay attention to sports? :)

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A Tumbuka lad in exile

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from: tiwonge
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:12 am (UTC)
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There are no billionaire owners in the World Cup. Each team is sponsored by the country's football association, and not by a single rich guy.

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i

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from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:21 am (UTC)
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i didn't realize that before. i guess i'm ranting at professional sports, not the world cup.

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Sunshine

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from: sunshine_two
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:31 am (UTC)
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My apologies Dave. I was speaking in generalities, and not answering your obvious question with specifics.

With regards to your observation, I guess it depends on how seriously you take the sport, and game.

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i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:38 am (UTC)
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and i just found out that in the world cup, the players are from their home countries. D'OH!

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Martin

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from: madderz
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 09:00 am (UTC)
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Nope soccer, or football as we like to call it, is no different to other sports. To play for a national team you have to have some claim of nationality, or a close relation and as far as I know that has to be by birth rather than what Zola Bud did some years ago when she just changed citizenship to get into the olympics.

You don't have to play league football in your own country tho', if they did the likes of the US wouldn't stand a hope.

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i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 09:07 am (UTC)
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that is a major difference if you actually have to have citizenship. it makes it easier to understand. i was under the impression that few if any of the us players, for example were actually from the us.

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A Tumbuka lad in exile

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from: tiwonge
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:01 am (UTC)
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Like whom? If the players for the US national team weren't born here, they came here at an early age and grew up here in the US playing soccer. I'm not aware of anybody playing on the US team who didn't grow up in the US.

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i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:13 am (UTC)
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i'm not sure where i got the idea. guess i was wrong, sorry. probably the last time i paid attention was when pele was in the news.

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A Tumbuka lad in exile

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from: tiwonge
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:23 am (UTC)
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Pele was Brazilian and played for the Brazilian team during the World Cup.

He played for the New York (?) Cosmos back when the USFL was around. But that's different from the World Cup. That's professional soccer, not international soccer.

In professional soccer, you play for whichever team in whichever league you can get into. The best (and hence, highest-paying) soccer leagues are in Italy, England and Spain. The best soccer players will play profesionally there.

The World Cup is more like the Olympics where you play for your country, not a team that pays you. (Not that you don't get paid for playing in the World Cup, but countries don't try to buy players from other countries by offering higher salaries. Not that I'm aware of, anyway.)

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i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:32 am (UTC)
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the Cosmos. *hits self on head* now i remember.

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глюкiosaur de champlain

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from: chaizzilla
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 02:24 pm (UTC)
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hee that was cute

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A Tumbuka lad in exile

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from: tiwonge
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:09 am (UTC)
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US National Team Roster

It lists the hometown of each of them.

I'm looking at the first player listed (Jeff Agoos), and it says that he was born in Geneva. However, he's played for the US teams since he played for the Under-15 squad, and attended the University of Virginia. While he wasn't born in the US, he grew up here, and this is his home. In our country, this makes sense, since we are a country of immigrants.

I wasn't born in this country either, but if I had madd futbol skillz like these guys, there's no other country I'd play for.

Some of the better players play professional ball internationally, but when their country calls (for the World Cup and other international events), they play for this country.

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i

Re:

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:20 am (UTC)
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so the world cup is sort of like a soccer/football olympics?

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A Tumbuka lad in exile

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from: tiwonge
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 10:25 am (UTC)
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Exactly. And it happens every 4 years, like the Olympics.

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Martin

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from: madderz
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 02:47 pm (UTC)
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And players get set fees that bare no relation to their normal wage. I think you get something like 4000 for the whole thing, I know it's pretty small in comparison to someone like David Beckham getting 90000 a week. sometimes there are bonuses and stuff like that and the rules are always being stretched but generally it should be an honour to play for your country and that's pretty much the ideal used in all the rules.

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Martin

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from: madderz
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 02:41 pm (UTC)
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I dunno, to me citizenship is just where you live fulltime and has very little to do with your identity. If I moved wherever on a full time basis I would have to become a citizen after some period if time, but I would still call myself British. This probably stops me from moving to America 'cos you have to, alteast verbally, give up your identity.

To be a member of a national team you should have been born or have a parent who was born (in the case of parent's it may be that they have to have been born and be current citizens, not totally sure) in the coutry you want to play for.

So the members of the American team will have been born in or have close ties with America and many have only moved away because if you want play top-class football you need to be playing in Europe or South America and many players will no-doubt still be American citizens and on work permits.

I don't think it's particularly difficult to understand and it stops coutries 'buying in' players.

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A Tumbuka lad in exile

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from: tiwonge
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 09:47 am (UTC)
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I think those are the exceptions and not the rule. The star Polish player was born in Nigeria, and the star French player is of Arab descent. (I don't know where he was born, though.) For the most part, in the World Cup, players play for countries they have a natural connection to. (The Nigerian-born Polish player became a Polish citizen recently.)

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Soccer

from: ilenebook
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 11:54 am (UTC)
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The only kind of soccer I follow is my granddaughter's games. By the way...nice icon i.

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i

Re: Soccer

from: i
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 12:16 pm (UTC)
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thanks soccer mom :)

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глюкiosaur de champlain

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from: chaizzilla
date: Jun. 8th, 2002 02:20 pm (UTC)
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i don't really have a fave team, usually when i watch a game, i start to feel a sense of pressure form one side or the other (the ball's basically spending too much time on one side or the other), then i tend to start rooting for the pressure to even out but then i'm pretty much in the groove with that team for the game. sure if scotland or canada (or norway or russia i spose) actually made an appearance i'd root for them, or if i just really liked the uniforms on one team (or one team member, whee..). i don't have enough tv to build up a sense of where the leagues are at, but i just friggin dig soccer.

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